Book 2 – Page 94

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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby BanzaiJoe » Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:09 pm

"So everybody can go home. You know how it ends now." - Phillip
"Hush, Phillip." "No spoilahs" - Marie

Is it just me or is Phillip blatantly baiting for a response. It's framed as a potential spoiler, but it's as if he's calling out so as to get the next step going, namely JoJo coming back as "One last thing" a predicted part of the event.

Anybody else get the idea Phillip was totally baiting JoJo and whoever was on the thinkagram?
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby Sieggy » Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:19 pm

Oberon wrote:
BLANDCorporatio wrote:And yeah, that's the thing with neutrality as seen in Stupidworld as well. Often, it isn't.
Right. The US was 'neutral' at the start of WWI, but shipped massive amounts of support to England. So German U-boats started poaching our shipping. And the rest is history.

Yeah, there's a lot more to it than that. This is the grade school history book version. The point being valid all the same: When A and B are fighting, if C keeps handing B another stick while claiming to be neutral, sooner or later A is going to call bullshit on C's so-called neutrality.

Actually, Hitler declared war on the US a few days after the US declared war on Japan, and without Germany's declaration of war, the US would have had no reason to do so. Had Hitler not been such a bonehead, of course, it would have been necessary (and not very difficult) to create a causus belli. This, BTW, was probably the second most monumental mistake Hitler made (the first was in bungling Operation Barbarossa). Hitler had this silly notion that Japan was going to invade India, and then strike west into the Afghan plains while he struck east through the Caucasus and the rotted remnants of the Ottoman holdings, and they'd all have a happy meeting in the oil fields of Persia. Oops.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby sheepfly » Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:03 am

Sieggy wrote:
Oberon wrote:
BLANDCorporatio wrote:And yeah, that's the thing with neutrality as seen in Stupidworld as well. Often, it isn't.
Right. The US was 'neutral' at the start of WWI, but shipped massive amounts of support to England. So German U-boats started poaching our shipping. And the rest is history.

Yeah, there's a lot more to it than that. This is the grade school history book version. The point being valid all the same: When A and B are fighting, if C keeps handing B another stick while claiming to be neutral, sooner or later A is going to call bullshit on C's so-called neutrality.

Actually, Hitler declared war on the US a few days after the US declared war on Japan, and without Germany's declaration of war, the US would have had no reason to do so. Had Hitler not been such a bonehead, of course, it would have been necessary (and not very difficult) to create a causus belli. This, BTW, was probably the second most monumental mistake Hitler made (the first was in bungling Operation Barbarossa). Hitler had this silly notion that Japan was going to invade India, and then strike west into the Afghan plains while he struck east through the Caucasus and the rotted remnants of the Ottoman holdings, and they'd all have a happy meeting in the oil fields of Persia. Oops.


I'm sure you just misread it (same way I did the first time) and thought "that's not right," but Oberon is actually referring to World War I, as in the Great War, and the general analogy is correct.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby elecampane » Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:32 am

Also, is Maggie still in the tunnel? I kinda thought she has joined Parson's group by now, but she's nowhere to be seen either. It would actually be funny if she and Jack managed to form bi-mancer link and cast foolamancy veil on themselves, Wanda and predictamancer guy in glasses (to make him look like Wanda), while Maggie was in thinkspace arguing with Isaak. Not shure if that's possible, though, since links require a lot of concentration.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby Guppy » Sat Oct 27, 2012 7:56 am

Whispri wrote:Has Jo-Jo just recieved orders from Charlie??

Or possibly, Jo-Jo merely thinks he has received orders from Charlie.

If Parson were to step through now of his own will, it would be an act of war. But what if Parson were to be forced to dodge somewhere after Jo-Jo initiates hostilities and takes a shot at him? Worse, what if Jo-Jo takes a shot and kills a thinkmancer? MK opinion would turn against the Carnys, to the benefit of the Minds and Parson.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby Morni » Sat Oct 27, 2012 8:00 am

I like the last 2 panel. I think the authors are telling us the readers a message.

Wait for one more thing until the fun begins.

This isn't the moment. Wait for one last thing, "One last thing. Here it comes"


of course i'm probably reading too much into it.. but a guy can hope right?
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Sat Oct 27, 2012 8:01 am

Sieggy wrote:
Oberon wrote:
BLANDCorporatio wrote:And yeah, that's the thing with neutrality as seen in Stupidworld as well. Often, it isn't.
Right. The US was 'neutral' at the start of WWI, but shipped massive amounts of support to England. So German U-boats started poaching our shipping. And the rest is history.

Yeah, there's a lot more to it than that. This is the grade school history book version. The point being valid all the same: When A and B are fighting, if C keeps handing B another stick while claiming to be neutral, sooner or later A is going to call bullshit on C's so-called neutrality.

Actually, Hitler declared war on the US a few days after the US declared war on Japan, and without Germany's declaration of war, the US would have had no reason to do so.


As mentioned, Oberon was speaking of WW1, not WW2. But funnily enough, a similar point could be made about FDR's Cash-and-Carry bill of 1939, and the later Lend-Lease of March, 1941: while militarily neutral, the US was playing economic favorites among the belligerents, before formally entering the war. A true historian would be better able than me to put all those in perspective; for one, it's not like the US was devoid of Nazi sympathizers at the time, and for two cash-and-carry didn't quite yield the expected effect.

But those are just trees of the forest which is, 'it's hard to be completely cut off from everyone else, hence it's hard to be uninvolved in a conflict, even if indirectly and without military participation'. Out of that grey mess all sorts of trouble arises; when is 'indirect' participation state policy and becoming a covert act of war?

This isn't to say that neutrality is meaningless. It's more to say that often, it's mixed with an attempt to delay the inevitable(?). Case in point, the MK, trying hard not to have to systematically send its casters in risky brawls between brainless warlords populating Erfworld, trying hard not to have its territory in contention. But war keeps coming knocking on their door and sooner or later they'll need to pick a horse in the race. It may not even be the same horse, which will be a bit awkward.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby Thoke » Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:48 am

The next text update might be from Jack's point of view, or I really hope it is. At least he has had some time to think of a plan, and he probably has come up with something. He probably enjoys trying to solve a puzzle like this. :)
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby Smoker » Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:37 am

I read the "no casters" thing as directed at Sizemore, Janis and all the predictamancers who are siding/stacking with Parson. If Wanda and Jack entered the MK through a particular portal, then they should be leaving by it.. since we've never heard of casters visiting allies through their portals, it seems reasonable to me that transporting casters across the map for zero move would (or at least could) be equally against convention.

Also consider different circumstances: If Boo the shockamancer was blasting the heck out of an enemy capital, found himself running low on juice so jumped through the enemy portal into the MK waving bags of Rands and calling out for scrolls, do you think the other casters would say "Na-uh-uuh, sorry Boo! You go back to your home Portal now! Do not pass go, do not collect $200."

Seems a bit silly to me.

I'll be surprised if Jack and Wanda are turned away.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby joosy » Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:54 am

bladestorm wrote:
bladestorm wrote:He was mentioned before. I think he may have been deemed a lookamancer or something. I'll see if I can find the article that mentions him. He was supposed to be several other characters, but ends up looking like Dick Tracey.

Nevermind. According to this, he is a Carny.


If I had to guess I would surmise he was a Findamancer. I would further speculate that this is the last barbarian caster from Unaroyal: Spenser. This would have multiple references to Spenser for Hire, a U.S. TV show from the 80's, the imagery of Dick Tracy, a comic strip character from the 30's which could also lend itself to Spencer Tracy (a U.S. actor from the 30's-50's).
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby effataigus » Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:59 am

Awwww, in b 4 nothing at all. Get on a plane for a day and miss all of the forum fun.

I agree with ye esteemed posters, though I think Smoker just made a pretty important point... specifically that our puzzlement (rage? confusion? complaints?) all hinge on a single (albeit the most likely) interpretation of Isaac's bizarre comment... and the comment was anything but clear.

But yeah, I've quit campaigns for less non-sequitur plot-ram-rodding than what people are afraid of here (kinda, I was a bit more graceful than that, and found a plasuible side quest for my character to pursue solo). That said, those campaigns weren't very good even allowing for the ram-rodding, unlike Erfworld.

And OMG, if this whole 40 panel stand-off culminates in Jojo saying "Gosh, guys, color me red! Nevermind!"... then I will sadlol.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby splexis » Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:11 pm

On reexamining the strip I noticed that the character to the left of Brunhilda in panel 3 has his pupils differentiated from the whites of his eyes.

As far as I recall, only Parson, Wanda and Jillian have this characteristic in Erfworld: are we witnessing a new major character stepping onto the stage?

What are the common interpretations of the significance of the whites of character's eyes?

CAVEAT: Brunhilda herself has whites of eyes, but since these probably result from the way she is being drawn true-to-style of the original comic strip character, perhaps the whites of her eyes do not signify?



Also: Link (or maybe Peter Pan) is in the last panel in addition to Ahn.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby effataigus » Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:27 pm

splexis wrote:On reexamining the strip I noticed that the character to the left of Brunhilda in panel 3 has his pupils differentiated from the whites of his eyes.

As far as I recall, only Parson, Wanda and Jillian have this characteristic in Erfworld: are we witnessing a new major character stepping onto the stage?

What are the common interpretations of the significance of the whites of character's eyes?

Nice catch! Your list is missing Jack and Manpower the Temporary (and perhaps someone I'm forgetting).

There is a large amount of speculation about the significance of having eye whites (or sclera as people sometimes call them on these forums). I don't believe we have a single answer, or even one accepted by a majority. People have suggested that they are people destined for arkentools, people that are controlled by people from Earth (in a PC sense... keeping in mind that Manpower the Temporary was replaced by Parson), and people that are very important to fate. Others have contended it is just an artistic choice that dates back to the days of Jamie, when the art played fast and loose with realism in order to emphasize only what was important... i.e. who cares about making an overly-expressive mook.

I'm guessing that guy either isn't significant to the plot (just was penned in from a picture with that same strange pose to satisfy the kickstarter promise of incorporating donors as TMK cameos), or perhaps this is Jack under veil.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby elecampane » Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:45 pm

splexis wrote:On reexamining the strip I noticed that the character to the left of Brunhilda in panel 3 has his pupils differentiated from the whites of his eyes.

I suppose it's beacause he's real-life person parody. Or, rather, parody on real-life mockery on the real-life person.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby YRM_DM » Sat Oct 27, 2012 4:42 pm

kefkakrazy wrote:
The Bushranger wrote:...I guess that means you don't read Girl Genius. ;)


To be fair, while Girl Genius does really crawl at times (especially back during the arc inside the castle!), they also manage to keep to a rock-solid three-per-week update schedule. I think Erfworld's historically rocky update schedule has worked to really compound a lot of frustration here, even though Rob and Xin have been *really* good about the two-per-week schedule.

Note that I'm not saying the delays are not understandable. The stuff that Xin is going through is unbelievably crappy and she's the comic's sole artist; GG has a professional colorist, while attempts to procure such for Erfworld fell through, and both of the Foglios are long-time professional artists to boot.


Like I said in my original first post, I think it's fantastic art, a quirky, cool story, and generally enjoy the comic. Life's limitations are what they are.

People here are pretty cool and I'm definitely not saying the comic isn't worth reading.

Consider just this one thing. Parson first stepped through the portal in MARCH OF 2011.

It is now October of 2012. That's what? 19 months?

Rob is obviously not a stupid person. He knows he writes a comic that posts limited updates. He knows personal situations. He knows how to write a good story. I'm just suggesting, in this instance, this 19 month stall for Parson to walk the length of a football field and argue a lot, might not be the best thing.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby joosy » Sat Oct 27, 2012 5:27 pm

Quit yer bitchin', you young whippersnappers.

Why back in Book 1 we were lucky to get a page a month and we were grateful for it - not like you young punks of today.

We had to go through six feet of snow, uphill both ways, using a 9600 baud modem to get our updates and we liked it just fine.

grumble grumble.. get of my lawn.. mumble mumble.. soda used to cost a nickel.. .. harumph..
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby rkyeun » Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:15 pm

Spoiler: show
He still doesn't go through next page. Or the one after that.

Okay, Rob. The point has been made. Erfworld has turn-based time controls and unlimited time allowed between turns per player. If you don't hit ENTER, Parson will sit there staring at the portal for ANOTHER 18 months and eat another 36 pages. Hamstard would probably phrase that more eloquently than I did.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby splexis » Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:23 pm

elecampane wrote:
splexis wrote:On reexamining the strip I noticed that the character to the left of Brunhilda in panel 3 has his pupils differentiated from the whites of his eyes.

I suppose it's beacause he's real-life person parody. Or, rather, parody on real-life mockery on the real-life person.


And yet, the other real-life person parody doe not have the whites.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby splexis » Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:30 pm

YRM_DM wrote:Parson first stepped through the portal in MARCH OF 2011.

It is now October of 2012. That's what? 19 months?

Rob is obviously not a stupid person. He knows he writes a comic that posts limited updates. He knows personal situations. He knows how to write a good story. I'm just suggesting, in this instance, this 19 month stall for Parson to walk the length of a football field and argue a lot, might not be the best thing.


Just maybe this book is not about what happens after Parson walks through the door.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 94

Postby Smoker » Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:43 pm

Some of the complaints of the massive delay in the MK make it sound like thats the ONLY thing that's happened in this comic lately...

and like, yeah... it isn't..

joosy wrote:Why back in Book 1 we were lucky to get a page a month and we were grateful for it - not like you young punks of today.

This! The updates are fast enough lately that even if every third or fourth one (I'm guessing, if you wanna work out the ratio, lemme know) is devoted to the Portal fiasco, you're still getting lots of Erfy goodness each month.
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