I think that Parson's leadership stat really does correctly reflect the ability that it is supposed to measure, and I expect that they are directly connected, though it's all just my speculation. Of course Parson is brilliant at strategy and strategy is what wins wars, so that's all that Parson really needs, but I don't think that the leadership stat of a unit has anything to do with that. The leadership stat doesn't give people orders, it doesn't position stacks of units for maximum effectiveness, and it doesn't decide when to advance and when to retreat. The leadership stat simply provides a blanket bonus to everyone under the warlord's command, and to me that means that what the leadership stat represents is the warlord's ability to inspire his troops with things like confidence and determination. In other words, Leadership is a charisma stat, and it's one of Parson's weaknesses as a warlord.Lipkin wrote:The leadership stat is the Erfworld representation of actual leadership skill, right? And Parson is starting to show that the leadership stat and the actual ability to lead a battle are not necessarily linked.
Based on my above speculation, I have to say that nothing at all prevents units from acquiring new skills, except that they probably have orders which keep them too busy to practice. But if a unit did have the time to pick up a skill the hard way then I expect that the Natural Mathamancy of that unit's stats would change to reflect the new skill, because the whole purpose of Mathamancy is to accurately report those sorts of things.Lipkin wrote:Lack of the archery special doesn't keep you from making a ranged attack, it just means you suck. But knowledge is divorced from mechanic. Is there anything stopping a unit from learning new skills?
I think you're right that no one ever puts the time in to actually learn anything, except training to improve their existing skills, and the reason is exactly because they don't experience immediate success. Manually training a stabber to give him the archery special would take many turns and prevent the stabber from doing other things, essentially wasting your stabber. If you just want an archer then you can just pop one. You might even be able to spend shmuckers to instantly promote your stabber to an archer. I think that because it is so slow it is probably not exploitable, just because it is inferior to the more traditional Erfworld ways of doing things.Lipkin wrote:If units were capable of learning simple skills, it could be hugely exploitable. It's possible no one has ever put the time in to actually learn anything, because they didn't experience immediate success.
That sounds like exactly the sort of thing that Erfworlders aren't likely to think of, but it might also not be exploitable. Take for example building siege towers which were talked about briefly in Book 0, Episode 6. When you pop a siege tower you also get digger units to man the tower; they pop together and they are used together, just like Wrigley was popped with a spear. You can't build units on an assembly line, and popped units come with their own tools, so it seems like all you could end up doing would be tying up many units building siege towers that have no diggers and spears without stabbers. I agree that having spare weapons and tools would surely be a good thing, but I'm not sure it would be worth the cost of the assembly line.Lipkin wrote:Teach each unit to do one small thing, and suddenly you've drastically increased production of siege, or other items of import.
Lipkin wrote:Oh, it's totally exploitable. Make assembly lines. Teach each unit to do one small thing, and suddenly you've drastically increased production of siege, or other items of import.
Lamech wrote:There has been no indications of a "tech tree". That's not to say research isn't possible, simply that it is like our worlds research. You learn stuff somehow. "If you make stabbers dig with shovels for several hundred turns they have a tendency to become tunnel units or diggers". Maybe you can refine it. Or you catalog all the monsters in your area. The problem is there are very few thinkers, very little flow or preservation of information, and they are using "classical" mindsets.
I suppose its possible that some specialty buildings, magic or special ability might let you get a wider variety of units. (The arkentools seem to.) Who knows, maybe there is some not normally possible combination. Again though that is like Earth research, not computer game tech trees.
It's not directly supported, but the text does make it clear that Erfworlders are quite human in the ways that they think and behave. I would be shocked if apparently smart Erfworlders are incapable of learning simple tasks that are outside their specialty, but for the same reason it would make sense that they would learn in just the same way that a Stupidworlder would, and hundreds of turns is not a long time to get good at something if you start as a total novice.Shai_hulud wrote:I don't think the claim that learning takes hundreds of turns is supported by the text.
Shai_hulud wrote:I don't think the claim that learning takes hundreds of turns is supported by the text. The only two information sources on training times was Word of Titans saying that leveling is exponential, and the extreme amount of time needed by Artemis to level from 7 to 8. No information has been given about unlocking new skills or gaining new classes, and if that requires leveling to do.
Two Stabbers in silver and white Faq livery saluted him as he entered. A Royal guard of only two. Not even Knights yet.
Yes, you leveled," said Ansom, knitting his brow. "It caught my attention."
"I did," said Artemis, allowing herself a grin that was more satisfaction than seduction, "from six to seven, by training alone. I've trained up Knights, as well."
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